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No. 273189
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Bless our cowgirls.
No. 273190
>>273186nta but what are some off-the-rack stores with small sizes in the west? i'm a 14 shirt in north america and some menswear stores on the big shopping street in my city (canada) still have mall-type sizing.
uniqlo and muji are in canada now. they have good small stuff. [/spoiler]i'm 177cm and 57kg[/spoiler]
No. 273192
>>273190I usually just thrift but H&M, the brands you listed, random Asian brands (Shein) and XXL or XL little boys or large/xl boy juniors will fit decently. Only thing with little boy clothes is that the neck holes are a bit small for Tshirts.
It depends on your breast size of course but if you're flat, this could work.
No. 273246
>>273192oh you buy shein? i have too many problems (paranoia?) about fast online retailers. something bad is happening if you look at shein's prices. they must be sourcing from very badly treated workers.
i've never even thought of looking at children's clothing but I guess here the children's stuff would be tall enough for an adult kek
No. 273260
>>273233- straight women can't be butch they're just gnc or tomboyish or they're just women. Being a butch hinges on your relationship with other women and the nuances that your interactions take on in contrast with her as well as your presentation. You can't be butch in a relationship with a man.
Bisexual women can be but imo it's only butch in the context of relationships with other women.
Butch is not just a style or look, though that's part of it. Traditionally it's a role, a feeling about yourself, and a lifestyle no matter what 'type' of butch you are.
- tomboy is a boyish or gnc /non 'traditionally' feminine woman. A butch is a lesbian who takes on a certain role, has a certain style, and engages in a certain lifestyle / view of herself as butch. What that means to her varies but nonetheless it is butch. There are some stereotypes but it's up to the woman.
- Depends on the person. Not personally.
- You're welcome.
>>273246I do at times yea. I've had this same thought and while I'm sure they're hiding something, I've done some research on what is available on Shein and they pay their workers pretty well/conditions (as reported currently) are much better than other fast fashion sites due to the way they handle production.
That said, I don't cape for shein and I order for them more for ease and cost than anything. I'm still contributing to the problem and don't deny that one bit. One day I won't order from them anymore and don't blame you if you don't. In fact, I commend it.
You'll find some surprisingly nice things in the boys/teen boys section and it's very comfortable.
No. 273327
>>273324Same anon and I agree with you. I unfortunately don't remember where the article I read was for interests sake but that is true. Even if the textile workers were being paid fairly (if I recall it claimed so) that's still incredibly grueling work and likely not work that one can do by choice. If they're paid fairly it's work that one would stay in for that sake which limits options and if not, it's more slave labor for the sake of fast fashion so it's lose lose in that regard.
Supporting is supporting so I'll be sticking to my usual methods (thrifting) instead. I appreciate your civility.
No. 273343
>>273334I understand what you're saying. I stand by what I said, but case by case basis always get more sympathy from me.. you're still a same sex attracted woman, you're still butch when you interact with women, and so on.
I'm sure it would rub some people wrong but just do you and don't have a zoomer style crisis. It's not worth it to give yourself a complex. Hope your relationship is going well and best of luck w/ everything bi butch nona.
>>273336You're not bougie for it and that's admirable but remember that not everyone can do that. Don't get on a high horse.
>>273342IA.
No. 273642
>>273601I'm that anon and having thought about it I don't think I disagree with you. Bisexual women and lesbians have same sex attraction in common some of the time but there is a distinctness to lesbianism and the (to use your wording) 'genders' within it. They can be masculine presenting but being Butch/Stud is about more than that.
Using "gender" here is an interesting way to put it btw, yet very succinct.
No. 274751
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>>273709seconding this! I would love to see more butch media/art. I know Catherine Opie does some decent work and is known for her work in the 90s scene. I prefer her self portraits.
No. 274757
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>>274751do you know the name the woman in the photo? i think shes so hot, i have this photo of her in my gallery, i think its from the same shoot.
No. 274758
File: 1657588660562.png (Spoiler Image,1.14 MB, 1047x820, 119b27184b28b213fc5d8a82158c18…)
what are your thoughts on JD Samson?
No. 274761
>>274758What a sad butch thread. Bi
nonnie trying to make excuses where it's ok to call herself or others bi-butches and someone posting nonbinary genderspecials as butch women. This breaks my heart.
No. 274762
>>274761Please
nonnie accidentally post a tim that you confused as a women because they're androgenous.
No. 274814
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>>273233Tomboy to me feels very childish/teenage i’ve never heard older woman getting called that but butch feels like what young and old women/lesbians get called.
There doesn’t seem to be a specific look for tomboys, usually they’re sporty and “with the guys” but I think overtime androgyny started getting more popularized. Butch always had a specific look that can get them easily mistaken for men
No. 274837
Can we just call this a masc woman general and stop infighting? There's already a lesbian general for lesbian specific discussion. This thread is a magnet for rage bait and trolling and you're all too retarded to just not reply to the rage bait so it's going to be a dumpster fire. inb4 hurr shut up bihet I'm a lesbian and I'm saying this because I'd love to have a thread to talk about female masculinity without 1200 replies of
>>274761 style retardation and nitpicking.
No. 274842
>>274837Well then why wasn't it called the Masc women thread? Bibutch-larper apologist. It's not retardation or nitpicking your blase attitude on certain words lesbian hold dear being used by women that center men is retarded.
>>274835You sad you're getting some pushback on using lesbian terms that don't apply to you? boo hoo.
>>274803And help you guys larp better? No thanks.
No. 274855
>>274842> You sad you're getting some pushback on using lesbian terms that don't apply to you? boo hoo. Ayrt, and no, you silly goose! I posted
> Can a straight women be a butch or a bisexual woman or not. Also what is the difference between butch and tomboy. Also do any of you change yourselves for others. Thank you for answering my questionsI think me asking this question in the first place caused a lot of infighting kek
I myself am a homosexual female who dresses idk kind of swag? And didn’t exactly know how people used ‘butch’. I don’t care for labels, I’m curious though. I just feel like the rage is a bit unnecessary fam
>>274837I agree, masc woman thread fits way better, and I would love to see it.
No. 287507
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Thoughts on suspenders? I've been really liking them, feels pretty comfortable.
No. 303817
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>>273491>I'm one clingy pillow princess away from moving away to a monastery for the rest of my life because I have shit luck trying to attract other regular women, all of the ones I come across are already taken, more attracted to femmes, honest heterosexuals or just plain not my type. Please someone tell me I'm not alone with this.At this point I'm almost starting to miss the clingy pillow princesses or bicurious women treating me like scrote-lite, because this drought is making me go insane. Realistically speaking it wouldn't make me any happier and only fuck me up further, but I just hate feeling like such an incel. I've mainly been attracting self identified asexuals the last few years and that's something I won't get into, I don't want to be shamed for being sexually attracted while being in a relationship. At this point I might as well join a monastery. I get that butch is not attractive to most and I'm not exactly the most attractive butch either and I am a fucking weirdo, the desperation I try to hide isn't exactly attractive either, but come on. I'm legit considering travelling or moving to a different country just to eat pussy.
No. 305508
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don't mean to vent but im a dysphoric butch who's been on T since 16 after thinking i was a tif and it sucks. i do genuinely have dysphoria and T has alleviated a lot of it but ive been in a really bad state lately (hospitalization, moving) and the two times ive tried to go off T i almost 41'ed. i was extremely masc/butch growing up, cut my hair off after my parents told me no when i was 12, never looked back. the isolation from other women was already hard as a butch lesbian but now i just get read as a somewhat effeminate man/androgynous person and it should make my dysphoria better but it just doesn't. i really do want to be a woman again. any other detrans butches out there?
No. 305540
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>>305536thank you
nonny. im genuinely doing a lot better than i used to mental health wise, but my health is turning to shit and im kind of worried it's from the T. i'll get through this and i'm trying to love myself again, it's just very lonely. i don't know what to think of myself after being so passionate about my transition for years, especially as a child, surrounded by other children desperately wanting to transition. i'm just trying to get my feet back on the ground.
No. 325025
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>>305508dysphoria butch here again. thank you to the nonnas that gave words of support, im officially completely off T as of 2mo ago and im never ever looking back. my dysphoria was misogynistic & deep rooted self hatred and im so much happier, i have a femme girlfriend and im going to college again and all that. sorry to spam the butch thread with this stuff but ive gotten my life back on track and i'm excited about it. im so happy im not a TIF anymore, i don't care about the "deep" voice (i already spoke in a low register so i avoided developing frog voice) or the spotty facial hair. no one will take my lesbianism from me again. much love to all the butch anons on here, it's hard especially when people try to pressure you into thinking you're trans, but you're not alone!
PS, corduroy pants are fucking amazing for a versatile and relatively masculine clothing choice. i have a brown and a black pair and they work so well with my belts and suspenders, plus if you're a short
nonny like me the boy's selection is astronomically cheaper than any women's pants of the same type. i got mine from levis. american giant also sells women's hoodies/jackets that are slim fit but very sturdy, with big pockets and solid construction. mine has lasted me like 6 years with some cuff fraying and the build looks identical to my dad's male version.
No. 327070
>>325025Hell yeah this is great news. Much love to you anon, glad to have you on your healing journey.
>>327069Bisexuals can't be butch so your gf is masc since she was willingly with a man before.
No. 327100
>>327070I’ve asked her if she’s attracted to men/men’s bodies and she says no she’s disgusted by them and penises. I think when she dated him she was deep in her tumblr handmaiden phase (some guilt tripping on his part too by what she told me) , she doesn’t go to collage anymore or hang around those old friends just follows them through social media. She also told me that in her previous relationship with said male that they rarely had sex/it was really bad… I genuinely believe it traumatized her, he would force himself on her and she refuses to call it rape. She used to take testosterone because the Tim ex talked her into it, she said she regretted it and has stopped taking it since she started dating me
Bi or butch or whatever, I wish there was a way for me to convince her just disconnect from it all
No. 327125
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>>327069i don't have specific advice but wish you luck and suggest checking out this collection of women talking about being abused by TIMs.
https://store.ugly-truths.com/l/youtoldme?layout=profile No. 327320
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>>327069detrans butch here, i relate a lot on trying to date a tim but mine was with another dumb high school kid when i was in 10th and i dumped him after 2 weeks lmao. if a woman dates a man and realizes she hates dating men that doesn't mean she's automatically bisexual, even if said man is a tim. if we applied that standard to everyone then we'd lose half the lesbian community in america lmao, plus as you showed tims can be super manipulative. the guilt for not dating a "lesbian trans woman" is unfortunately very real in handmaiden and tif circles.
the book the other anon recced is great, but in general in order to peak someone it doesn't have to specifically be about tims. the second sex, the scum manifesto, and a lot of phyllis cheslers work were essential to me peaking. of course you have to bring in dworkin too if you really want to go all in, but the scum manifesto is probably the easiest/shortest read.
don't try to mind game her into this stuff, just be honest and frank. try to draw her attention away from troonery and just love her for who she is, a lesbian butch woman. solidifying my existence as a gnc person and reminding myself i don't exist to be perceived (funny how internalized misogyny/TIF shit connects in that way) helped me SO much.
also go out to feminist/lesbian/women's events. invite her along to stuff, seek out lesbian bars or women's art spaces if there's any in your area. honestly just try to disconnect from the internet as much as possible, once you're out in the real world enough the troonery nonsense fades real quick. the connection to other women is very important too.
and at the end of the day if this really is putting a strain on your relationship please sit her down and talk with her at length. it doesn't have to be pretty. just talk to her as the woman you love and what you want for her, and why you want it. trooned out butches, especially ones who had radfem partners or friends, think radfems or any desisting woman are just a hivemind recruitment force out for blood. be kind, be honest and be gentle. good luck nonna and we all support you! and always remember you can't "save" everyone and if she's an adult woman she has to be responsible for herself at a certain point.
No. 332886
>>330931Thank you for all the tips! Those are all things my ex did and I would ignore them because I was really interested in being with Someone like her. Thoughts on dating a butch who’s heavily into politics? I think the reason she related to mtf trannies was because of the stone butch blues book and they almost all called themselves communists but obviously weren’t
I just want to avoid the same mistakes I made with her
It’s been a month since we’ve broken up and I’m feeling better about it, it hurt a lot because she was my first lesbian relationship and so many other firsts
I’ll try not to clog up the butch thread so much after this, thank you!