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No. 37672
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I used to be a radfem, mainly because I hate trannies infiltrating female spaces, but what really made me hate radfems almost as much as troons is the way that radfems constantly try to equate anything that they personally disapprove of with rape. As someone who has been a
victim of actual rape, it's just incredibly insulting. No, sorry, but my brutal rape is not even remotely the equivalent of someone selling foot pictures on OnlyFans.
Here, for example, is a popular thread on Ovarit where radfems unironically argue that Lily Phillips choosing to have sex with a hundred men is worse than Gisele Pelicot being raped by dozens of men because Lily Phillips chose to do it:
https://ovarit.com/o/WomensLiberation/632788/a-message-to-male-lurkers-regarding-lily-phillipsYes, a woman like Lily Phillips choosing to have sex with multiple men is TOTALLY the same as a woman like Gisele Pelicot being raped by multiple men. In fact, it's even worse BECAUSE she chose to do it!
Nobody trivializes rape and insults actual rape
victims more than radfems do.
No. 37673
>>37672Ill agree what happened with Lily is not the same as the years long nightmare that Gisele went through because of what her monster of a husband did to her. However, to say Lily was completely informed in her consent is also inaccurate.
Lily did not get those men properly tested for diseases. She didn't even know you could get stds via oral. Her ignorance is something akin to a child's. The fact that her parents enabled and helped organize the 100 guy challenge is messed up in its own right. But its not as blatantly, open and shut evil as what Gisele went through.
Im sorry you got raped. In a perfect world we would have publicly executed any man convicted of sexual assault long before you were born.
In an ideal world we wouldn't have stories like Gisele OR Lily.
No. 37678
Observing radfem behavior on this very site is what alienated me. Radfems will cry about "pornsick moids" one minute and post yaoi shotacon the next minute. They'll claim that they want to exterminate all men and cheer male suicide rates, yet they'll focus all of their energy on nitpicking, harassing, and tearing apart other women, even wishing rape on other women for not feministing right. The rhetoric that I see from radfems on here (and other sites filled with radfems) is even nastier than the rhetoric that I see from male incels. Radfems are a fucking joke. They are nothing but bitter, miserable
femcels. The best description of them I've seen is from a Crystal Cafe thread about Ovarit:
https://archive.is/8yDrx
>I remember when they were on spinster and planning on making it. Tbh spinster had basically the same problem, you have these main pearl clutching terminally online losers who are obsesed with controlling everything bc their lives are a mess. Another spinster orbiting site was cliterati.club which was also basically exactly the same except the authoritarian woman running it was some 28 yr NEET with a xan addiction, so at least you could laugh at her. You can't laugh at these 50 year old tinpot tyrants, they're not even good as lolcows No. 37707
My issue with feminism is that it seems to be a distraction for what the actual problem is and just another way for scrotes and women to generate $$$
Radfeminism is the psychotic version of feminism, I stand with some points and sometimes not like:
>>37673>did not know she could get STDS via oralCan you please not believe that lying whore? She’s literally lying about not knowing HIV is an STD. I secretly wish she gave the men HIV instead. Yikes.
No. 37718
>>37713Actually most lesbians have HPV or some sorts. You’re telling me that celibate
femcels are the only pure ones? But lesbians don’t find them pretty, they’re
femcel for a reason. It’s gonna be a rough world. Ok I hate men too but to say all women are whores if they want to have sex with men just because they don’t wanna be lgbt is kind of unfair. Some just believe in adam and eve instead of adam and steve. Or Eve and Stacy.
No. 37736
>>37718>Ok I hate men too but to say all women are whores if they want to have sex with men just because they don’t wanna be lgbt is kind of unfairWhy are you adding your own words to something that I said kek
I said if they HAVE sex, not if they want to have it. I can totally get having sexual desires, but having them and acting on them are two different cases. I can be attracted to someone's body but acknowledging they're evil by nature and therefore I won't be fucking them. And what's about the lgbt part? Where did I mention ldbt? You can't "become" lgbt, I don't believe in political lesbianism, you're either gay or not. I'm not a lesbian myself. I'm bisexual and I never fucked men and it was by my own choice.
No. 37754
>>37750Oh I agree both men and women are evil and both are capable of heinous shit.
But I also think men commit the lions share of evil deeds. Also sometimes it feels like when women do fucked up shit they are actively groomed into doing it whereas men are more likely to do horrible shit independent of influence.
Like think about the
femcel shooter and her gang of nazi edge lord groomers (and of course the retard dad who gave her the gun). Without those men in her life there would be no way she would have shot up the school.
I'm not saying there aren't completely and independently evil women. But they are the exception and not the rule.
No. 37804
>>37678
>Radfems will cry about "pornsick moids" one minute and post yaoi shotacon the next minute.Many radfems are actual pedophiles. Germaine Greer is a perfect example. Greer is a known pedophile. Germaine Greer published a book that was just pictures of prepubescent boys:
https://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/books/im-not-germaines-toy-says-cover-boy-20031018-gdhlyf.html
>Andresen, who shot to fame as a 15-year-old in 1970 when he appeared as Tadzio in Luchino Visconti's film Death in Venice, was furious Greer used a photo of him taken on the set by David Bailey.
>"Adult love for adolescents is something I am against in principle," Andresen told Britain's The Guardian newspaper. sourceGreer writes:
https://web.archive.org/web/20120118164400/http://www.abc.net.au/tv/enoughrope/transcripts/s946782.htm
>Finishing the current book is more difficult than it should be, because I just can't let it go. Working on it has been the best fun in the world, because it is a book of pictures of ravishing boys. Ravishing pictures of ravishing boys. I know that the only people who are supposed to like looking at pictures of boys are a sub-group of gay men.
>Well, I'd like to reclaim for women the right to appreciate the short-lived beauty of boys, real boys, not simpering 30 year-olds with shaved chests. The real snag is that everywhere I turn I find new pictures of absolutely outrageously lovely boys, and it's too late to get them into the book. But I keep downloading them, scanning them and printing them, just in case, and just for fun. source
>A woman of taste is a pederast — boys rather than men. sourceIn an article in the Sunday Times titled "Pretty boys get Greer excited":
>"This book is going to get me into a lot of trouble," said Greer. "I'll be called a paedophile after this."
>Greer, who first shot to fame with her feminist tract The Female Eunuch more than 30 years ago, defiantly sets out to counter the argument that "everyone thinks the only people who like looking at young boys are gay men". "That's not true," said Greer. "I, for one, love looking at them."
>The twists and turns of the feminist icon's pronouncements have shed many of her followers over the years, but her interest in young boys may prove the last straw.
>Miranda Devine, Australia's best-known female columnist, commented: "Once you get over the hypocrisy of the godmother of 1970s feminism salivating over boys as sex objects, you are left with the fact that in promoting this book Greer is using the language of paedophiles."
>Greer, who two years ago suggested that Tony Blair "stay off" Cherie when she became pregnant at 47, cites the sort of young man who really excites her. "It's the billboard advertisement of a truly lovely bare-chested boy, sitting legs apart and arm stretched along the back of a sofa with the flies of his jeans unzipped just far enough to reveal the designer name woven into the waistband of his underpants."
>The book will point out how the beauty of the young boy has been admired from ancient Greece through to the Renaissance artist Caravaggio. In the 20th century the young male body once again became an object of beauty and sometimes desire — whether in the shape of the dancer Nijinsky or the actor James Dean. No. 37877
>>37804Greer's point in that book is comprehensible but it is kind of cringe (correcting the imbalance by going after boys…okay). I think this book reflects her position in the 2nd wave. She has a very different angle from say, Dworkin, she's more brash and less about trauma, plus she's from a country (Australia) where 1st wave feminism didn't really happen. Australians are massive degens (kind of like south koreans and other countries that rapidly moved from backwards traditionalism to full-fledged porn-infused cultures). So it's not surprising she's
like that in comparison to american or euro 2nd wave radfems, who spent more time thinking about sexual ethics. Her difference is what makes her works so interesting imo. And she often uses 'boy' for adult young men, she's always been a little edgy.
>Many radfems are actual pedophilesCitation needed
No. 37892
>>37891Nothing terrible. The energy in the room was just kinda off. You could tell that a many of these women are terminally online and have no political thought outside of internet radfem frameworks. Someone went on a rant about how white women were being attacked on ovarit for having opinions and I couldn't have rolled my eyes any harder.
I plan on trying out a SSA women's group soon. Hopefully that goes a bit better.
No. 37898
>>37895They are desperate because feminism at its core is politically orphaned. The feminists who think conservatives will save them are absolutely retarded. I understand democrats also suck but at the very least it feels like they are slightly more open to anti trust laws and not moralfagging so hard that women die from miscarriages.
any woman that cucks herself into believing the shit conservatives say is less of a radfem and more of a pickme.
Also them thinking Trump, the guy who fucked a porn star while his mail order bride took care of their autistic son, would EVER ban porn, is especially laughable.
No. 37941
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Like all authoritarian movements based entirely on identity politics, radfems spend far more time attacking each other than they do attacking the people that they claim to hate (in this case, men).
No. 37987
>>37984>I'm not pro-porn or pro-troon btw I just think it's easier to bring normie libs around to our side than it is to remove all the misogynistic bullshit from the Christian right.I used to believe this but it's obvious now both are just as hard. Libfeminism has been the mainstream flavor of "feminism" for decades now and it's only getting worse. Imagine the state of libs men when even libfems are promoting prostitution, being a bangmaid, gender ideology, porn. And they do all the things tradwives do, just with a girlboss cope. They aren't even delusional about their moid being faithful and moral, they know and accept that he's a lazy slob cooming to underage tiktok dancers. Both sides are shit, women are going to pick what's more relatable or useful for them as selfish as it is. Also, people not
actually believing in tranny shit is the default, it doesn't make them a member of the GC/radfem community. Realistically radfems are still very rare, it's mostly online discourse, whereas the vast majority of women IRL actually believe in libfem bs or at least parrot it without seeing anything wrong with it. We're doomed. I wish 4B was an actual thing in the West.
No. 38004
>>37987>And they do all the things tradwives do, just with a girlboss copeTradwives think God wants 12-year-old rape
victims to die in childbirth. Tradwives want to give up the right to vote in exchange for headpats from Nigel. They are seriously not the same. Libfems are retarded but at least they believe in basic civil rights and body autonomy. If you seriously believe that Trump is better than libfems you need to get off the internet for while.
No. 38005
>>38004>me: both sides are shit and difficult to bring around to our side>you: you think trump is betterAnyways, libfems want men to access women and girls' spaces, libfems think it's empowering for teenage girls & young women to prostitute themselves, libfems think it's fine for gay/gnc children to get sterilized and transed because they can consent, libfems think the porn industry (full of minors and human trafficking
victims) is OK, etc. Both sides openly promote pedophilia and misogyny. Most women (like you it seems) are in denial because that realization is too bleak.
No. 38548
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>>38547Bitch I am single and far too happy and busy to gaf about what other women are doing. Maybe read the other posts itt about how ratfems are fucking annoying because they always assume anyone who disagrees with them couldn’t possibly just be a normal woman who is sick of their shit. Maybe single women hate you because you make us look like jealous losers.
No. 38553
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>>38549If you’re so insecure that you need to convince yourself every opposing opinion is bait, then you need to hear it.
>>38552And I’m still happier than you. Stay unloved,
femcel bitch.
(infighting) No. 38625
>>38586If my mom knew what the world
femcel was I would just give up and die in the womb
No. 38954
idk how to say this but ive been here 7 years and it's never been so overtly right wing here. terf/gc is actually a conspiratorial pipeline and I've been mentally much healthier after realizing this. I used to think there was some legitimacy behind some gc ideas, and I truly thought I was a feminist with women and even gay men in my best interest, but I was so wrong. gc, especially the takes I see lately have zero nuance, like it's just fully gay bashing, slut shaming, racism, on full display. Idk I just think, how can every single trans identifying person have the exact same motives, you have to have black and white thinking to believe that way. The same thing with men. I get some degree of man hate lol like I have gone through awful experiences with men and patriarchy is definitely a serious and harmful oppressive thing, but men are not "inherently" violent pedophile rapists or whatever else. I feel like this line of thinking almost makes an excuse for men, that they have no control over their "nature". Yes they do, and men and women should stand together against patriarchy and oppression. And on an anonymous image board anyone can be posting here to shift culture, create scapegoats, and cause division. Idk I could go on, but I fear it would fall on deaf ears. I miss the lighthearted funny times of the old internet, but those times are gone and I guess I have to accept that.
No. 38957
>>38954I don't consider myself a radfem but I'm definitely a blackpiller, and all moids/troons acting the same is explained by biological facts and observation of our closest animal relatives. You don't need some sort of feminist theory abstraction to understand male motives, they really are not that complex, it all boils down to how most male mammals act like, and you can specially grab conclusions by studying chimps who are over 98% similar to humans. You can definitely argue that in humans you can make a male understand that for example rape is bad, and so he will suppress his sexuality in order not to rape, and this is true, but it only works as long as the male in question is aware that there are social repercussions that will happen to him if he rapes. This is why women's rights are thrown out of the window during wartime, or when women are kept in captivity like jail, or when women are homeless, etc. Men believe that they won't face social repercussions in those contexts if they rape women, thus their nature is no longer held back by human constructs, thus they rape.
Yes, you can find men who have never raped, but can you find a man who has never abused a woman in one way or the other? Most male mammals are built to see females as resources, thus they want to control women to have access to reproduction. It's why relationships are always all fine and dandy until the woman starts speaking up her mind. A female who cannot be controlled is worthless to the male, specially if she's no longer sexually available or capable, which also explains the raise of abuse during pregnancy since naturally speaking men are unable to differentiate if a pregnant woman has conceived their child or not, and being rational about it seems to have a limited impact of this.
Now that's just about the male thing, you can keep looking for "the good one" but honestly you would just be deluding yourself. Now about the troon stuff, the things I said about males apply to them in the first place (and HSTS are misogynistic in a gay man way because they are gay men). And second, you cannot change your sex with surgery and cross sex hormones. Just because of this very simple fact, troons will never be women, so there is nothing else to argue about troons, really.
No. 38959
>>38957How do you explain women who rape other women then? Failed
terf rhetoric moment
No. 38965
>>38957the thing is i just dont buy that line of thinking as someone with both a BS in environmental science and a healthy, loving partnership with a male who doesnt act like a chimp
i really do understand being blackpilled because i truly was at that point for a time. i know it comes from a very real place of pain. the ideology is way of making sense of what happened to us and to make sense of whats happening in the world. a way for us to protect ourselves from being hurt again and to "save" other women from being hurt.
im being sincere when i say this, but the cure to being blackpilled truly is just getting out there, making friends irl, and trying to spend less time online in spaces where we are reinforcing our biases over and over again to an unhealthy degree. im not saying never go on lc ever again, but maybe consider that you could be reading posts written by literally anyone on here, including people who have a vested interest in creating division and culture wars.
isnt it at least a little concerning how eager right wing media is to use gc/detransitioners voices? they are just dividing and conquering us. do you really want the government to have the power to define what it means to look, act or feel like a woman? you shouldnt, if you value bodily autonomy.
i really believe the biggest problems we face are economic and structural: unfettered capitalism and systems of hierarchy (including patriarchy), which we can actually address only when we join forces and dont allow ourselves to be divided.
genuinely, go to the library or use a vpn and library genesis to read books about civil rights and social movements that go beyond the gc perspective. this is coming from someone who read andrea dworkin, kajsa ekis ekman and leirre keith btw.
No. 38978
>>38954once you begin to realise that so many pillars of gender and biology are invented (as are many things in this world), the rage behind so many gc ideas boils down pretty evenly to racism/misogyny. my philosophy has grown a lot to be to live and let live even when i don't understand, but it's always amazing to see some of the
terf arguments on here that read as "real women do XYZ", tying themselves in knots about what a "real" woman is. not to say "women" don't exist (as both a marker and as a class), but i think there's so much nuance and lived experience so ignored by terfism/gcism, but these things need some belief in bio essentialism to make any sense, and bio essentialism at the end of the day sees women locked in their house with no income, no life, shackled to the kitchen sink. but if you enter the world with so much hatred and so much distrust based on 'things you read online' or, more specifically 'things you read on lolcow, where everyone leans right-but-in-a-gc-"woman"-first"-way', then there's just no hope
i don't come here for politics, but i feel bad for anyone who's first interaction with a lot of these ideas is through this site. when you and the people posting on /pol/ and the presenter on all major right-leaning news sites align, you are probably not the feminist in the room - and i find it miserable to see how many women on here could probably be well-spoken, articulate, and intellectually curious if they weren't so addicted to the rush of being at the front line of a political debate that keeps its opponents at bay by making them fight each other over and over again because they dream of a world where everyone else is or can be property
No. 38985
>>38954>I feel like this line of thinking almost makes an excuse for menThe exact opposite is true. Humans are wired to want a partner and children so women make excuses to keep giving men a chance because at the end of the day they want a family or relationship. Don't get me wrong, I'm not blaming women for this. Men are the same in the sense that even those who pretend to hate women and go their own way cannot stop talking about women for a single day. But the big difference here is that men have raped and kept women uneducated across the globe for centuries, it's still the case in a lot if not most countries, and yet man-hate is considered some kind of terminally online
femcel activity? Can you point to another group on the planet that is so lenient and forgiving with their oppressor? I'll wait. Of course you can find men who don't rape (the bar is in hell) but they're still watching porn tagged #teen behind your back. It's ok if you decide to turn a blind eye for your own sanity but it's still sexual exploitation that keeps men's sexual urges at bay. I understand that lc can be depressing but I wish people were able to stop browsing this site without claiming that we're all sexist homophobic racist crazies to appease their cognitive dissonance. You chose your peace of mind and optimism, that's fine, but please let other women choose differently without being vilified or censored. That's a recurring issue with libfems/TRAs.
>>38965>isnt it at least a little concerning how eager right wing media is to use gc/detransitioners voices?And isn't it concerning how the left uses the voices of gay/gnc children to promote transition and consent for minors? Conservatards agreeing with gc women that humans can't change sex (groundbreaking I know) doesn't make gc women right wing. That's not how it works.
>do you really want the government to have the power to define what it means to look, act or feel like a woman?Oh ok so straight up bullshitting now? Aren't TRAs the ones to think that being a woman is about how you feel on the inside or how you look after a few surgeries rather than what you actually are biologically?
No. 38986
>>38965>tl;dr "dick cured me". women don't belong to "the other" group of misogynistic men just because we don't suck your nigel's dick.>>38978wow gc = me want woman in kitchen,
terf = nazi + 4chan but vagina, big brain. hatred of misogyny isn't oppression of misogynists. handing meanie feminists over to Male Group B by declaring that we're their property if we're not acting in the interests of Male Group A is you treating women as property. "live and let live, i stopped fearing what i don't understand + i don't understand it because i'm just a dumb closed minded womenz in recovery which is real feminism teehee. educate yourself tho nazi
terf" yeah you're clearly waiting for the women here to say amen and follow you to church/tiktok lmao.
>>38983the patronised biased preaching, presented as nuanced deep analysis, is gpt3 bot tier yeah every time lol. why do the lolcow-reformed libfems always preach the same basic tranny rhetoric shit like it's profound? blaming everything on capitalism because they "read a book, unlike you" is a classic. just constant, repulsively self-congratulatory mental gymnastics for why they swapped HATRED and PAIN for LOVE (sucking their nigels' dicks and insulting women who don't). but they're only trying to help you find Him too ("HIS dick is gonna save us all from having to suck those bigoted other dicks over there y'all trust me girls, unity is the way, open your heart/legs").
No. 38988
>>38965>do you really want the government to have the power to define what it means to look, act or feel like a woman? yes I do want the government to, like it does with men who have inielable rights based around their biological sex. Because the court of public opinion is the one that overturns rights and does not enshrine them. Just because the U.S allows crazies and gentiles regularly in office in their oligarchy half dmeocracy to overturn women's rights doesn't mean the idea of a government as a body should be thrown out. Governments have safe guards to protect from mob rule, the U.S had the supreme Court but it got fucked up.
>>38965I'm glad for you to push that women just need "good dick" as a solution to being mass raped and murdered in the global South, and still abused, having our rights taken away in the global north. Good dick is the solution to womens rights being taken away on a global scale and once women get dicked down in a stable relationship the feminists will calm down and pop out babies becoming good women who aren't full of anger and hate anymore. Also I'm not sure how environmental science is relevant at all to this discussion kek. I have a BS too and also did an elective of environmental science, though it wasn't my major. Does my opinion suddenly hold more weight and that's worth mentioning for some reason that I have a STEM degree in an irrelevant conversation about womens rights? You lack the rigor and fidelity that one would expect of even the shittest STEM graduate when your method of induction and hypothesizing ala the scientific method is based around womens solution to social ills getting dicked down and entering a stable relationship of regular dicking. Women getting dicked in stable relationships gets the feminism out is a very rigorous scientific methodology.
No. 38989
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i'm a radfem but terfs are extremely prone to retardation like any other conservative/reactionary ideology. picrel made me laugh out loud becuase the list is all fake, made-up, "woe-is-me" problems. coexisting with ugly people isn't an attack on you, it's called being prosocial. the fact that this person didn't even mention rape says a lot about how much they actually fear for their safety bc of trans women. a lot of you just hate feminine men, and you need to stop pretending you have some noble political goal at the end of it all. inb4 go back to twitter reddit liberal blah blah blah
No. 38996
>>38989>the fact that this person didn't even mention rape says a lotthis isn't tranny central, nonna doesn't need to mention rape, murder and genocide to make a point about gender ideology. i like how you prefaced your post with "i'm a radfem" and then proceeded to explain that women's concerns are laughable unless it's rape lmao. good one
>a lot of you just hate feminine menfeminine or not, men do
not belong in women's spaces and they aren't women. that's the entire point but you're too busy defending men to get it. it is
not women's job to protect and coddle men who like to perform femininity. try the guilt-tripping trick elsewhere maybe
No. 39006
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I like radical feminism, but I don't think it'll come to power. Women can't rise because too many of them will always put penis honor before anything else. Maybe like 1% of women on the planet aren't pickmes. You can't even talk on LC without seeing some gobbler concluding that something is good or bad or worth doing based on male validation, and they're like bots the way they try to discredit other women with accusations of envy/jealousy if they're not on board. For the jealousy argument to work, you have to already hold male attention in high esteem, and somehow, 90% of women can look at this and think it's worth worshiping. I just don't understand it. Them being physically stronger than us is only part of the story, so much of it is mental and literally deeply ingrained in their brains. It disgusts and scares me.
You can explain to them 100 times that life isn't meant to be lived competing for dick, that dick is easily attainable, that men don't actually give a fuck about things the way they think, that male validation is wrothless. I'd say you might as well be talking to a fish, but that's mean to fish. You might as well be talking to a brick wall. Feminism had a great run for all it's worth, but it's always going back and forth, two steps forward and one step back because there will always be dumb bitches holding it back. I don't know if the only hope is to force vasectomies on most of the male population and sterilize pickmes before they can go from daddy's little handmaiden to brainless boymoms, but it won't happen either way. I fucking hate it here.
No. 39043
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No. 39058
>>38988im not saying abolish all governments, im pointing out that empowering governments to define and enforce their definition of "woman" aka equating us with reproductive function leads to justification for state control over our bodies. i didn't bring up environmental science to say im big brain for getting a degree. the point is that anyone with a basic education in science should see that the previous anons "men = chimps" argument is flawed. fr it basically boils down to 'women are biologically
victims and men are biologically abusers.' these differences are better explained by culture and environment, including patriarchy (which we can change), than biology. there are no pink and blue brains. then again, i once had a coworker with a STEM degree who believed the moon was a spaceship, that humans were aquatic, and that all American presidents are predetermined, so i guess you're right, a STEM degree won't prevent someone from going down conspiratorial pipelines.
i said the solution to the misery of being blackpilled was making friends, not that the solution to misogyny is sex. sex is, however, normal, healthy and enjoyable. "women getting dicked" is such misogynist framing btw. womens sexual desire isnt shameful.
>>38985>it's still sexual exploitation that keeps men's sexual urges at bay.literally the same logic as incels, its just 2 sides of the same coin.
>I understand that lc can be depressing but I wish people were able to stop browsing this site without claiming that we're all sexist homophobic racist crazies to appease their cognitive dissonance. what i would give to come here and simply gawk at lolcows while i shit without there being 8000 of the same tired post sperging in every thread constantly about the trans menace and related politics. the quality of "milk" on lc has drastically declined in recent years, being replaced genuinely with what you described. btw i think its really goofy for anons like you to come to the literal only thread on lc designated for non radfems, just to complain that we're posting in it.
No. 39065
>>39063Im not a
terf so im not buying to that rhetoric. But still its funny to see libfems in here
No. 39111
>>39000AYRT, i really appreciate this response. thank you, you reframed some things for me and now they make a more sense. i dont have any male friends but i'm admittedly super tumblr-informed from when i was a kid so even if my opinions have changed i still kind of talk in the same way (saying "trans women" instead of tim"), and on top of that i'm a gnc woman, so the 'gender debate' is something i'm sensitive to because even if it's not about me, it's convos about masculine females and feminine males. so, i appreciate you taking the time to lay out your perspective.
>women who misunderstand the gender debate i think i could be one of these women! if you don't mind could you explain what you mean by "the gender debate"? i feel like you're referring to a lot more than whether or not gender can be trans'd (sorry for the cringe as fuck phrasing).
>once again it's not our job to protect the men who find joy in the standards that oppress usinteresting, i like this point. it's making me think about why i automatically include trans women in my feminism and how/if that benefits me. imo misogyny is hatred of femininity, not just the woman/female (to an extent because it also really explicitly hatred of female women), so there's a relationship worth examining between misogyny and transphobia; there's value to including trans women in feminism. what would you say to this?
>>39001treating trans women as equivalents to females/cis women in any context (social, medical, historical, etc) does not help anybody.
No. 39136
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>>39063Feminists achieved those things by fighting against the state, not by capitulating to it. The state is built upon patriarchy. Picrel is the single sex spaces conservatives want for us, which "radfems" are unwittingly aligning with.
>>39111>i'm admittedly super tumblr-informedtrading tumblr informed for lolcow informed isnt going to improve your critical thinking skills. please read a book
>>39065im not a liberal
No. 39160
Feminism is Controlled Opposition and i wish i knew this from the start before ever giving feminism a chance. Think about it, if we really lived in a patriarchy like how feminists sat then feminism wouldn't be allowed to even exist.
Feminism is only created for women who want to push a agenda, defend out of touch wealthy women and women who are antisocial narc abusers.
Feminism and especially the radfem sector, behaves like a sect/cult with the leaders/currently popular figures who you aren't allowed to criticise or question, the purity tests and politics and the ex-communication and punishment of those who fail the purity test.
Funny enough i had a much better view of feminism before i became a feminist compared to now after being a part of feminism communities for years and seeing with my own eyes how abusive and snakey these women are. It really is nothing but a retarded worthless cult who achieves nothing for women, in radfeminism it is used to infantilize tradthot women, defend right-wing men (example radfems defending pedo matt walsh just because he made that anti-troon documentary), spend all time talking about troons, try to psyop other women into becoming handmaidens such as acting like being around right-wingers who hate women is better because ''atleast they know what a woman is''. Radfeminism also has a huge political lesbianism problem and i suspect that a majority of the lesbian radfems are straight or bisexual because the way they act is so bizarre and performative the Intrasexual competition and hatred for women just oozes of these ''lesbian'' women. Also due to the cult behaviour of radfems and not being allowed to call out the leaders so many radfem leaders end up basically using the radfem movement for their own agenda which typically has to do with tradthottery like Meghan Murphy for example.
The other sectors are bad too, just look at that out-of-touch 11 minute flight to space that katy perry and those other women did for fun and they tried to pass that of as something ''feminist'' and ''divine feminine''….imagine trying to pass of something so environmentally damaging, pointless and bourgeois as being feminist….this is what i mean when i say that feminism is created for wealthy women.
I would even go as far as to say that even the older forms (1st and 2nd) were worthless too and wouldn't have achieved anything if the industrial revolution didn't happen.
i have never met this many bpd abusive women before i joined feminist spaces either which is ironic, it's basically women who want to abuse and control other women and children and get away with it just like men do.
From today on i want nothing to do with feminism nor will i ever call myself that and i fucking regret it so bad being used as a pawn by other women with ulterior motives. Truth is there is no feminism or even patriarchy because it takes two to tango and it's all biology and i believe biologically BOTH men and women hate women and no amount of socialization will ever help or psyop someone into being a better person. Fuck feminism, individualism and only caring about oneself is unironically more feminist than being feminist or being a part of feminist communities.
No. 39161
>>39160To touch on 1st and 2nd wave I think feminism was always a ruse and women tend to act in their best personal interests that is having offspring and securing a mate to have offspring with. This is the main motivator of nearly all women ever. Secondarily, securing resources needed for survival and the survival of offspring.
This is why the average age of a mother was around late 20s-30s in the 1920s following the suffragette movement but this steadily dropped by the 1950s-60s to teenage and early twenties. In the 1940s women began working due to the war but there was a massive shift towards antifeminism by the 50s and 1960s that women acted daft about. This is because occasionally women's true desire by numbers poke through which is having offspring and caring for offspring. It's the same reason why most women become mothers. They want offspring and want to please men. By the 70s there was genuine outrage at the emergence of rape on tape but that whittled away because it's second to the desire of women to have families and a mate. Utlimately the proof is in the pudding with women; they have no problem with rape being normalized, pedofilia, that women are disfigured from pregnancy and have serious health complications, that religion sterilizes and mutilates women, forces children to be raped and give birth etc. Because it benefits their individual means. It's a means to an end for most women. Patriarchy couldn't exist without collaborators, and patriarchy is just the natural state of males in species who are physically capable of beating and mass killing all the females, so women concoct stories about males to live in delusion. If you admit all men are pedofiles, that all would rape if given the chance you can't live in a world where you get to secure a mate and offspring from a chosen man. Women know what they're doing, they know the deal they make. Most women hate other women because they're a barrier to their goal.
No. 39163
>>39160>if we really lived in a patriarchy like how feminists say then feminism wouldn't be allowed to even exist.oh come on, people have always resisted oppression throughout time, think about slavery and civil rights. patriarchy is a powerful social system and it works through things like cultural norms, economics/politics, etc. patriarchy isnt a secret shadowy conspiracy where theres a room full of men deciding how theyre going to oppress us next.
>Feminism is only created for women who want to push a agenda, defend out of touch wealthy women and women who are antisocial narc abusers.while women are the most affected by patriarchy, feminism is literally for the good of all people because patriarchy also impacts men negatively.
woc and impoverished women are hit the hardest because of the intersecting systems of power they experience, so they absolutely have the most to gain from feminist movements.
>just look at that out-of-touch 11 minute flight to space that katy perry and those other women did for fun and they tried to pass that of as something ''feminist'' and ''divine feminine''….imagine trying to pass of something so environmentally damaging, pointless and bourgeois as being feminist….this is what i mean when i say that feminism is created for wealthy women.what youre describing is corporate co-opting of feminism. you can blame capitalism for that. its the same thing as greenwashing and pinkwashing, its just exploitation of the movement for profit and pr. it shouldnt be conflated with feminism in general or used as a reason to dismiss feminism entirely
>It really is nothing but a retarded worthless cult who achieves nothing for women>From today on i want nothing to do with feminism nor will i ever call myself that and i fucking regret it so badim not going to entirely defend radical feminism but it sounds like youre just describing your individual experience in online spaces, which you know, my condolences. radical feminism has a lot of problems but why throw the baby out with the bathwater?
>Fuck feminism, individualism and only caring about oneself is unironically more feminist than being feminist or being a part of feminist communities.individualism alone will never lead to liberation.
>>39161>By the 70s there was genuine outrage at the emergence of rape on tape but that whittled away because it's second to the desire of women to have families and a mate.howwwww is it somehow womens fault??? this argument is so annoying, feminism is an ongoing struggle, literally just look at the #metoo movement, women are still fighting against rape and abuse. women are not "biologically motivated" to thwart our own liberation.
>Patriarchy couldn't exist without collaborators, and patriarchy is just the natural state of males in species who are physically capable of beating and mass killing all the females, so women concoct stories about males to live in delusion.again somehow blaming women for our own oppression. patriarchy is a social system which is interconnected with other systems of power and control. while powerful, patriarchy is culturally economically and politically enforced. just like other systems of oppression and control we can eventually change and improve upon them with dissent and opposition, like we already have to some degree over time. patriarchy is not normal or natural or biologically innate, its just what we've got right now. slavery and racism was once (and still is in some spaces) justified "because of biology".
No. 39169
>>39168thanks for proving my point, You radfeminists immediately resort to misogynistic attacks towards women by calling them dirty or defiled for not being muh virgins
unfortunately for you i am celibate by choice and don't have a sexual past with men unlike (you) radfems who seem to love themselves some cock even when they call themselves lesbians. Idk Maybe try therapy for your traumatic sexual experiences with men instead of radfeminism.
>>39166there is nothing wrong with being celibate or a lesbian, the problem is that radfeminism is filled with mentally ill straight women who used to be prostitutes or promiscuous and have guilt or trauma over that so they become radfems as a way to feel ''whole'' or ''pure'' again. It's really creepy and almost gives some born-again christian cult vibes. So many of these straight women also become political lesbians and use their ''lesbian'' identity as a shield to get away with doing heinous things to other women and acting like control freaks. Radfeminism is just traumatized straight women with bpd who roleplay as lesbians and delete their accounts or sperg out whenever their past gets exposed.
>>39163you are a libfem, just because i hate radfems that doesn't mean i am okay with you libfems either. You are both trash. I still remember the damage libfeminism did during the 2012-2019 era.
>>39161you put it really well anon, i agree with you, the only thing i would also add is that they also treat it like a roleplay phase that they outgrow by starting a family or getting older. Also not just feminism but other activism too in general ive noticed that women tend to be in it for the short-haul and treat it like a aesthetic more compared to moids who tend to be in it for the long haul (just compare tif detrans numbers to tim detrans for example).
No. 39202
>>39188This. Radfem spaces are insanely lesbophobic, full of straights and bisexuals daydreaming about socializing men out of their biology. It's a stupid fandom for OSA women to cope about awful relationships they had with men in the past, have currently or plan to have in the future.
They might put up a facade of being pro lesbianism and separatism but in the end, when you actually start talking to these people, they always show open disgust towards lesbian sexuality and mock separatist women.
Radfem doesn't work as a movement because women don't mind their slavery at all and insist on serving their oppressor. Any attempt at taking their cages away or opening them, always ends up in captive women viscerally hating their savior and/or few others who willingly left their cages to be free.
No. 39249
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>>39006
>third guy in the picIs that a real-life Carl from Aqua Teen Hunger Force?
No. 39252
>>39247>How does it feel to know that you will never be loved by anyone?People will only love you for your femininity and beauty so i dont feel like im missing anything worthy
>How does it feel to be a lonelyDoesnt feel like anything in particular.
>worthless pimple on society's assAgain beauty is a useless currency and i dont care whether im seen as worthy or not by society as a woman because womanhood isnt valuable to me.
>How does it feel to know that you are infinitely more repulsive than even the most disgusting AGP troonFeels like a hyperbole. I dont have a bias against trans and queer people
>How does it feel to know that the only people who will ever even acknowledge your existence are equally pitiful losers on femcel sites?What is this even mean lmao
>Here's a bit of advice for the radfems/femcels reading this: do the world a favor and kill yourself. Get a rope and hang yourself. Get a gun and blow your brains out. Get a razor blade and slit your wrists open. Get charcoal grills and burn them in a room. Whatever you do, just end your miserable existence once and for all. You know you want toOk woman
>Not only am I an actual woman, but I'm a same-sex attracted woman - otherwise known as a lesbianKek no one in here cares about your brave choice to finger pussies and how much of a woman you are.
>And rest assured that the vast majority of actual lesbians find radfems/femcels to be just as repulsive as men doNo one wants to have sex with you. No one cares about your fake sexuality. Also arent they supposedly something 00,1%?
>You will be alone and miserable for the rest of your lifeSounds more preferable than living as a dumb dyke
>Do yourself and everyone around you a favor and end your worthless life nowGo back to whoring yourself to your wife dyke
(infighting/taking the bait)